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And the treeline would have come all the way back there?

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No, no, no, that's when, so that's like when they got here and they're out in the

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field and they're like, no, I was here and this is where it was.

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And then, yeah, the craft emerged.

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From out, when they all got back here, from out back there, by the treeline.

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Okay, mom.

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It means emerged.

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And they just saw like red light coming from behind the trees.

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At first, yeah, as close as they were about a hundred feet from it.

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It was about a hundred feet off the ground.

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The landscape does actually drop down back there.

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But, you know, in theory, if there was a big craft, it could hide there.

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The big event was called the incident at Exeter.

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And the incident at Exeter really became known to people, far and wide, after John Follis

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book came out.

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And it brought into fame and under the spotlight several figures.

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John was Norman Muscarello, who was as a kid going into the Navy at 18 years old back

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in the fall of 1965.

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And he was now visiting his girlfriends.

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Norman Muscarello was hitchhiking home from his girl's front house in Amesbury.

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And as he got to this farm, this large red object kind of swooped at him out of the sky,

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he was terrified, dove behind stone wall.

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Because it came out of a red glow with the ultimately blinking, blinking lights back

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and forth.

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And it literally terrified him.

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He was not somebody who got scared that he was...

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Well, he was laying in the stitch behind the stone wall.

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The object made a few more passes over him.

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Then when he thought it was safe to get up, he ran to the neighbor in the farmhouse and

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pounded on the door.

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This is like a one in the morning.

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They were like, we don't care what's going on.

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We're not opening the door for this.

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And to begin walking towards Exeter and hitchhiking, a car came by that did eventually pick him

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up.

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He got to the police station and he was shaking a nervous wreck of how he light his cigarette

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off him.

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Shredgel Tolen was on duty at the desk.

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And he knew Norman from around town.

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He knew he was a good kid.

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He could tell he was visibly shaking.

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He knew something had happened, but it couldn't be what he was describing.

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I mean, that just didn't make any sense to him.

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It was about this time that Officer Bertram walked into the station and heard the story.

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And he was really intrigued by it because he had just about an hour earlier on Route 101

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they stopped a car with two women in it who were frantic.

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When he approached the car and asked what was going on, they reported they were chased

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for about 12 miles by a large red UFO.

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So when the Muscarello report came in, it kind of resonated with Officer Bertram.

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He was like, you know, I think I'll pick up Muscarello.

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We'll go back out to the site.

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So he picked up the shaking white petrified young Muscarello.

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They went out there.

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They got out of the car.

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They get into the field.

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They're not seeing anything.

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It was really nothing to be seen.

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And then all of a sudden from behind the tree line, the manifestation of an object that

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was glowing red rose up out of behind the pine trees.

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And it moved forward and started to come over the policeman in Muscarello.

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So Muscarello froze and panicked.

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Bertram dragged Muscarello back to the cruiser and they called for a backup.

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Officer Hunt was already on his way.

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Hunt could see the object as he was pulling up to the scene.

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When David Hunt arrived, it just was starting a bit to start to head off towards Hampton

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Beach where you guys are staying over in the area.

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And the light was a blood red.

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It just was on both houses, five houses on either side like that.

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They all noted that the lights on it all blinked in the same pattern, like one, two, three,

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four, four, three, two, one.

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They said at the closest, it was probably about a hundred feet from them, a hundred

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feet off the ground, and about the size of a house.

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The Exeter incident is on the surface, just another UFO sighting.

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The most intriguing aspect of the event seems to be the number of witnesses involved as

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well as the amount of the time the object stayed on the scene.

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Like Dan Weasel's sighting, the fact that these crafts seem to hover in the air with

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lights flashing flies in the face of what we would expect from visitors from another

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galaxy attempting to simply observe humanity.

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UFOs have supposedly been visiting us for centuries now, but we still have no idea what

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their origins are.

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But that hasn't stopped researchers, investigators, and television theorists from staking their

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claim to a multitude of ideas as to where the UAPs are coming from, and yet, it all

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really boils down to just a small handful of core ideas.

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Martin Howeta, or Malava, is a tribal elder who lives near Rimrock, Arizona, who can help

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set the stage for the centuries of beliefs relating to the possible route of the UAP

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mystery.

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During our discussion, we were instructed to leave the name of Malava's tribe out of

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the interview, and also to refer to him as a Native American.

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It's important to remember that simply boiling down a belief system like that of Malava's

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people into one core principle is impossible.

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His people have distilled centuries of stories regarding the past and future of mankind,

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and to a series of sacred objects that no one outside of Malava's people and a few trusted

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friends have ever even seen before.

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The objects help to tell the tale of the star people, who, according to his ancestors,

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have been visiting Earth since the beginning of time, in an effort to save us from ourselves.

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I have to put it in a way that I have to protect my people, okay?

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So I'll tell you some of these things, and I'll show you some of the things.

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I really only showed a few people.

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This is the star people.

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They're not.

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They're not of this.

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They're not from here.

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They're from a different place.

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So what they would do is, they would look for these Xs on different planets and different

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worlds and different places on our Earth.

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That's why if you look really close to this, he's sitting on some type of a, it looks like

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a triangle, a black triangle down here.

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This over here in the corner means infinity, like outer space where it doesn't ever end.

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And then behind him is a giant star where he comes from.

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And over here is the moon.

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And this is Earth.

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This is like his spaceship.

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But, you know, it doesn't look like this.

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This is what they made to tell you this story.

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So all of these stories are part of all this, and there's a lot more that goes to this.

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This is the bottom where he takes off.

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This is clouds.

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This doll is not Mayan, but the headdress is Mayan because there are descendants of

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who we are.

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These star beings here, this is their porthole that they can go from one to another.

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While Malavis beliefs relating to UFOs cross the spiritual with the otherworldly.

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In UFO circles, the extraterrestrial hypothesis is the most commonly accepted idea as to who

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is piloting those unknown objects seen around the world.

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Because the UFO phenomenon is so widespread and hits a diversity of people, and because

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we don't really know what is responsible for the sightings, there's a whole breadth

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of possibilities and theories for what is actually a UFO or what's behind a UFO or

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what's piloting a UFO.

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I think for the most part, most people probably fall into the nuts and bolts or kind of classic

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E.T.

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theory where it's the little green men sort of thing.

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Extraterrestrials, which are beings from another planet, another solar system, another galaxy

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that are coming into ours and they have a variety of different agenda along with that.

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And that's speaking broadly for the general population as well.

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I think people are more susceptible to kind of look at that part of the UFO world and

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that's where most people probably start out and then either move into other areas or really

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entrench themselves or become skeptics.

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The theories range from everything from simply earth lights, unexplained, naturally occurring

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phenomena all the way to the point of them being identified as craft or spaceships from

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other worlds being piloted by extraterrestrial entities.

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Some people like to sort of isolate that and say, oh, these are physical craft that have

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come here from another planet.

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The more conservative kind of feel like maybe they're probes that are unmanned, they're

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coming here to check us out.

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They're still like, maybe they are unmanned probes that are doing the same thing, which

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is probably what we would do if we found a planet that was inhabited.

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We'd want to try to discreetly observe what they were up to.

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One of my favorite cases actually happened in New Jersey here on the East Coast and it

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was a witness by the name of George Jobarski.

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This is back in 1975.

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He was coming home.

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It was like three in the morning.

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He just closed up the shop.

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He was going down New Jersey turnpike.

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And he saw what he described as a puffed up pancake in the air, metallic and illuminated.

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And it was just hovering over this park.

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He pulled over and he gets out and he's looking at this floating metallic pancake and he sees

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two small beams beneath the craft.

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And they're kind of hunched over and he doesn't know what they're doing so he gets closer.

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But he said that these beams had what he described as snow seats on.

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If they were aliens, they definitely were prepared.

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They were digging into the ground and putting dirt into these little beakers and canisters.

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And he gets closer and closer and he thinks that they heard him and these little snow-suited

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beams, they scamper back into this craft and it just disappeared out of sight.

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So he gets in his car, he drives home.

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Did they leave something behind that they were coming back to get or did they just want

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to know what this stuff is below their feet?

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Why is the initial assumption that these are alien craft?

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It's something that, okay, what military doesn't have an explanation.

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There's a whole bunch of these things.

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You know, where did they come from?

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And I think that sadly people often default to the negatives.

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So when something like that happens, there are a lot of times there's an assumption,

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oh, this has got to be something really bad.

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It's got to be something really sinister.

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What could be worse than aliens dropping in?

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So it melded into the culture and we get this whole trend towards outer space beams.

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Now, I should say that there are problems with that.

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Obviously, there are problems in fact with all of these theories and that's part of the

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mystery that we're trying to solve.

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Sam Sheeran is a celebrated artist and an old friend.

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Like Ryan Sprague, Sam and I go back to the earliest days of my show into the fray when

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he used to co-host.

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One of the events that furthered his interest in unusual subjects was an encounter he had

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with the UFO in the skies above Los Angeles.

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An incident that helped cement his own personal opinion on where UAPs might be originating.

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So it was Halloween season 2012 in Los Angeles, Hollywood specifically.

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And I was staying with a friend at his apartment.

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We decided to step outside and have a cigarette off the balcony.

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We're quite familiar with LA.

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You see helicopters, you see airplanes coming from LAX and Burbank Airport.

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So you're really familiar with what we were of what flies around LA.

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It's not unusual to see helicopters and beams of light and things like that.

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I don't even think we'd lit cigarettes.

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My friend says, what the F is that?

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And we looked and sure enough, there's this formation of lights in a V shape.

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You're typical classic here all the time, you know, the black triangle thing.

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But this was just lights.

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They weren't flashing.

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They were kind of shimmering, twinkling.

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This thing was maybe the size of a commercial airplane, maybe 747, but way, way high up.

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And the lights were so dim on it, all white, that if you looked away and looked at the

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stars, the stars were brighter.

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If you looked away, you'd lose it.

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And it was cruising really, really slowly.

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No sound, no contrail, nothing.

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And we watched it until it disappeared.

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It literally went over the Hollywood Hills and away.

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Do you think it was something that we made here or is it something off-planet?

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I've thought long and hard about what this could have been.

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I've never seen anything anywhere else that that was similar to.

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This is something that can not only stand stationary or fly stationary rather than yet.

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It's silent.

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It doesn't have any emissions.

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It doesn't seem to have an actual structure to it.

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It's just a formation of lights.

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So that really makes me lean towards maybe it's a visitor, maybe it's a scientist from

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another world on a reconnaissance mission.

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I think a lot of modern sightings are just misidentified.

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And actually throughout history, people have real ignorance of what's in the night sky.

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But for at least a hundred years, I think there is credible evidence that there are nuts and

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bolts, craft from places with technology that is not human.

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And do I want to say it's alien?

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I guess I have to when you eliminate everything else.

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During the earliest days of flying saucer mania, there was almost cult-like fanaticism

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that grew up around UFOs and their occupants.

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While most sightings revolved around distant observations of strange lights or craft, there

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were occasional encounters with their pilots.

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During the late 50s and into the 70s, a movement grew up around the idea of extraterrestrials

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as a sort of savior of humanity, with many of those claiming contact with the aliens

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gaining an almost profit-like reputation amongst their followers.

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While this is an often overlooked period of UFO history, a lot of the information gleaned

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from contactees is still part of the subject today.

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It wasn't until investigators like John Keel began discussing the idea of the others being

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dimensional travelers that people began to consider other possibilities.

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There's even groups that believe that extraterrestrials are not necessarily from outer space.

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There's a lot of this multi-dimensional sort of theories being thrown around that these

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are actually overlapping worlds.

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There's flap areas, perhaps where there's high amounts of other paranormal activity

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going on.

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So I think it's interesting that it's taking a little bit of that turn because some people

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are certainly getting more onto that sort of train where they're not from space.

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They're from just another world.

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They could be us in a parallel universe.

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Ultra-terrestrials are people who are coming from an alternate dimension other than our

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own that stands alongside ours.

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And the barrier between the two dimensions gets a little wonkier weak, and that allows

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a pass-through between the two.

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Or that the aircraft is just so advanced that it's able to pass through between that barrier

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and create a window between the two dimensions.

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I think John Keele's place in the whole speculation around unidentified things in the skies, his

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contribution to that was the idea of there being sort of a cosmic trickster behind the

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scenes.

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I believe he coined the term ultra-terrestrial to indicate that there was a force or a personal

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presence operating on a spiritual level that we typically couldn't see.

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As being our beings would from time to time come into our reality mostly for the purpose

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of just messing with us for reasons of amusement that it seemed to derive from this activity.

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Where do you personally kind of fall in your own maybe theorizing or beliefs about what

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is at the heart of the UFO mystery?

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The tricksters are excellent at mimicking and playing tricks and trying to fool us.

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And I think it's an extreme irony that we think we're the only people in the entire

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universe.

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More and more when I'm talking to scientists who believe that there's something to the

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UFO phenomenon.

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They are more apt to believe that these could be something from alternate universes or other

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dimensions.

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You hear a lot in science about multiple dimensions and things like this.

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That mathematically the science shows that this is possible.

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I think there's been a move in relatively recent decades to explain UFOs in an interdimensional

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way to sort of take some of the concepts of quantum physics as they're popularly understood

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and to use that as a way of transporting something across vast spaces and times.

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My favorite quite honestly that these craft are something that are traveling through dimensional

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borders from other universes.

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I find that one personally very compelling because of where string theory and quantum

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physics has brought us today, you know, with this concept that, oh yeah, there are other

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dimensions of existence.

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We don't know how to get there, but we know they're there.

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It would account not just for UFOs, but also other paranormal phenomena such as other creatures

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or maybe even ghosts that maybe somehow are part of us exist in some other dimension.

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So those scientists, you know, entertain this idea and kind of think of this as a theory

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that would fit other paranormal phenomena.

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The idea of wormholes or things of that nature, portals if you will, has the benefit of being

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a convenient imaginative response to the question of how do you get a craft or a ship from one

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place to another across vast distances.

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It also has the benefit of not being provable or disprovable.

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The sheer bizarre nature of some reports is what has influenced some of today's investigators

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00:20:30,380 --> 00:20:36,100
to look beyond outer space for answers as to the origins of UAPs.

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Cases like those often reported in locations like the Chestnut Ridge, Skinwalker Ranch

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or Sedona seem to defy what logic would dictate if we are in fact dealing with a visitor from

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the stars.

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Many investigators find their perception of this subject in general shifting drastically

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the further they get into their tenure due to the strangeness of the reports they take.

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These cases often leave them asking far more questions than they had going in and occasionally

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can cause them to change their personal opinions on the origin of the phenomenon entirely.

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What's another case that stands out to you?

295
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Oh, there were some fun ones.

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There was a case in Northern Utah of two boys that are watching TV late at night, in 1972

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I believe it was.

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They were watching their favorite show and all of a sudden they're looking at what

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looks to be like a science fiction movie.

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Instead of a movie, the characters in the movie are looking at them like, what are you

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guys doing?

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00:21:44,360 --> 00:21:49,740
So they reached up to touch the knob and a big spark jumped out of the TV set and knocked

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him on his keystead.

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So he's wondering what's going on now.

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These creatures, whoever's on the inside the TV looking at them, wondering what's going

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on here because they didn't expect it either.

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So then the TV goes out, they run outside and there's a big UFO right over their house.

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So.

309
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Why do you think the UFOs are here?

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I don't know.

311
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We may be some science class experiment.

312
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We may be here.

313
00:22:18,500 --> 00:22:22,420
They may be here for a multiplicity of reasons.

314
00:22:22,420 --> 00:22:29,020
The idea that there are other realities that are typically unseen by us, but that occasionally

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touch our reality is actually quite ancient.

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Writing such as the Bible, for example, do describe a world beyond our own that does

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interact with ours.

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It doesn't necessarily use the language of interdimensional, but it does use the language

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of heaven and earth or principalities and powers that's interpreted in different ways,

320
00:22:52,940 --> 00:22:59,780
but certainly I think be understood in light of interdimensional or portals so that this

321
00:22:59,780 --> 00:23:05,140
idea has actually been around as long as there's been recorded history.

322
00:23:05,140 --> 00:23:10,140
What if the UFOs aren't coming from above or an alternate dimension?

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One of the most popular theories is that UFOs are simply us.

324
00:23:14,220 --> 00:23:17,260
But what does that mean exactly?

325
00:23:17,260 --> 00:23:21,860
In some ways debunkers would fall into this category as the typical assumption amongst

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00:23:21,860 --> 00:23:26,980
the skeptical community when it comes to UFO sighting is that it's either a, known

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00:23:26,980 --> 00:23:32,820
aircraft being simply misidentified or b, a hoax perpetrated by an intention-starved

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00:23:32,820 --> 00:23:33,820
human being.

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00:23:33,820 --> 00:23:37,980
But, there are other angles to this particular hypothesis.

330
00:23:37,980 --> 00:23:45,180
Of course the most conservative theory is that they are Russian or Chinese technology

331
00:23:45,180 --> 00:23:49,020
that is or even black projects that we're not aware of.

332
00:23:49,020 --> 00:23:53,780
Sometimes you hear about a more terrestrial theory where it's human beings, particularly

333
00:23:53,780 --> 00:23:58,820
the United States governments or other governments like Russia or China who have developed advanced

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00:23:58,820 --> 00:24:02,380
aircraft that they are testing in our airspace.

335
00:24:02,380 --> 00:24:08,100
And that's another possibility that the hard part for that one is that we've been seeing

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00:24:08,100 --> 00:24:11,140
this technology demonstrated for a long time.

337
00:24:11,140 --> 00:24:16,180
For instance in World War II when we're flying propeller planes, you know, they're seeing

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these balls of light zipping around all over.

339
00:24:18,500 --> 00:24:23,900
That's technology certainly that was beyond what we have now let alone back then.

340
00:24:23,900 --> 00:24:30,620
Then you have people who say, well flying saucers really are ships that have time travel

341
00:24:30,620 --> 00:24:35,500
and they're us from the future coming back to try to save humanity.

342
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Some people believe the little alien grays are what humans eventually will evolve into

343
00:24:40,620 --> 00:24:46,420
and they're coming back in order to try to save the future so to speak.

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While everyone has a theory as to the origins of UFOs, the best source of information tends

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to be the eyewitnesses themselves.

346
00:24:54,740 --> 00:25:00,140
People like Sean Kevin Jason and Sam Sheeran have seen similar yet unidentifiable craft

347
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in the sky and both have disparate theories about what may have been piloting them.

348
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It makes me wonder if there is an aspect of theorizing about where these things are coming

349
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from that acts as a sort of coping mechanism for dealing with a phenomenon that we might

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00:25:15,340 --> 00:25:18,500
never have any greater understanding of.

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After all, if we can at least catalog a sighting as merely secret government craft or aliens

352
00:25:23,980 --> 00:25:28,900
from outer space, then we've already answered a number of the questions we might have otherwise

353
00:25:28,900 --> 00:25:31,980
spent the rest of our lives asking.

354
00:25:31,980 --> 00:25:36,660
I actually had a sighting when I was 12 years old.

355
00:25:36,660 --> 00:25:43,300
My origin story, it was in 1995, it was the summer and I was fishing off the St. Lawrence

356
00:25:43,300 --> 00:25:46,540
River and I was with my parents.

357
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They were inside our motel, we were staying in a motel and the dock was right off of our

358
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motel and it was turning dark.

359
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As I'm really my line in, I saw these lights in the water and I thought something was under

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the water so I literally like got down, put my face in the water and then I realized it

361
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was a reflection.

362
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So I look up and I just saw three white lights in a triangular formation and a sort of red,

363
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orange, hazy ball in the middle.

364
00:26:20,220 --> 00:26:24,540
I didn't see like a structure or machinery or anything.

365
00:26:24,540 --> 00:26:29,540
I just saw the lights in a triangular formation just floating.

366
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They started to move across the water hovering silently.

367
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There was no noise whatsoever.

368
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I started yelling for my dad to like come out and see this.

369
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He did come out and actually see the tail end of this thing as it headed towards Canada

370
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and then it just disappeared out of sight.

371
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Now I think looking back at it as an adult I would think it was probably just a top

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secret military project.

373
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This is the 90s, stealth bombers were just starting to be tested.

374
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What was your sense, I guess, about the origins of what you were looking at?

375
00:27:03,100 --> 00:27:07,700
Did you think it was something extraterrestrial or a government secret government craft or what did you?

376
00:27:08,980 --> 00:27:13,060
That was a tough one because the lights told me it was man-made.

377
00:27:13,060 --> 00:27:19,620
Carl Sagan would say, you know, any sufficiently advanced technology would appear like magic.

378
00:27:19,620 --> 00:27:21,940
And there was nothing magical about these lights.

379
00:27:21,940 --> 00:27:26,140
You know, there are standard filament bulbs that have been around for a long time and

380
00:27:26,140 --> 00:27:29,540
you have the lights, you have the color, you have the shape.

381
00:27:29,540 --> 00:27:34,300
That was, from my perspective, an advanced stealth aircraft.

382
00:27:34,300 --> 00:27:40,380
Would it be disappointing to you if it was strictly government-made?

383
00:27:40,380 --> 00:27:46,260
I wouldn't be disappointed if it was military or human craft of some kind.

384
00:27:46,260 --> 00:27:48,300
For whatever purpose I wouldn't be disappointed.

385
00:27:48,300 --> 00:27:53,700
I'd be perhaps a little worried, perhaps a little bit, I don't know, betrayed.

386
00:27:53,700 --> 00:27:58,620
We're in such a world now where if they have this kind of technology there are so many

387
00:27:58,700 --> 00:28:02,220
problems in the world that they could be fixing.

388
00:28:02,220 --> 00:28:07,060
Yet they're advancing all of this into that direction and we're being lied to when it

389
00:28:07,060 --> 00:28:11,900
could be put to better use is a frightening prospect because what are they using it for,

390
00:28:11,900 --> 00:28:15,380
where are they going and potentially a frightening, could that be?

391
00:28:15,380 --> 00:28:23,380
Do you have a personal opinion on if these things exist, if UFOs exist, what is behind the phenomenon?

392
00:28:23,380 --> 00:28:27,380
Yes, they exist or people wouldn't talk about it or see them or all that.

393
00:28:27,380 --> 00:28:28,780
No, I don't know what it is.

394
00:28:28,780 --> 00:28:30,580
I really don't know what's behind it.

395
00:28:30,580 --> 00:28:33,140
I don't know if it's aliens, I don't know if it's coming from us, I don't know if it's

396
00:28:33,140 --> 00:28:36,620
misidentifications, it's probably all those things and more.

397
00:28:36,620 --> 00:28:40,860
The one thing I do know is that people get affected, people get affected very deeply.

398
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They have their whole lives changed in a few seconds.

399
00:28:42,900 --> 00:28:48,540
So if somebody says, this is what it is, it's like, okay, that's your view of what it is.

400
00:28:48,540 --> 00:28:50,660
I don't know if it is what it is.

401
00:28:50,660 --> 00:28:54,820
And especially with the UFO thing, there may not be any is there, the is is what we make

402
00:28:54,820 --> 00:28:56,660
of it in many cases.

403
00:28:56,660 --> 00:29:08,340
It's like a giant Rorschach blot, UFO, UFOlogies are the subject, I think.

404
00:29:08,340 --> 00:29:10,860
I don't really have a theory of origin.

405
00:29:10,860 --> 00:29:15,340
I guess maybe it's because I'm still trying to figure out if these things exist, as we've

406
00:29:15,340 --> 00:29:18,380
been told they do for decades now.

407
00:29:18,380 --> 00:29:23,420
Maybe there's something going on that we haven't even created a hypothesis about just yet.

408
00:29:23,420 --> 00:29:28,060
Or maybe the phenomenon is so difficult to grasp that every time we think we have a handle

409
00:29:28,060 --> 00:29:32,780
on it, it will change form once again and slip through our fingers and leave us floundering

410
00:29:32,780 --> 00:29:36,380
for answers.

411
00:29:36,380 --> 00:29:41,660
Witnesses like Ryan, Sam and Sean remind me of Norman Muscarello or any of the other

412
00:29:41,660 --> 00:29:45,540
witnesses that played a role in the Exeter incident.

413
00:29:45,540 --> 00:29:50,540
Following the incident in Exeter, the Air Force arrived to investigate the event and, as with

414
00:29:50,540 --> 00:29:55,540
many cases, Project Blue Book simply wrote the whole thing off as misidentification of

415
00:29:55,540 --> 00:29:57,460
known aircraft.

416
00:29:57,460 --> 00:30:02,260
In the years following, skeptics came forward to offer their own alternative explanations

417
00:30:02,260 --> 00:30:05,100
for what it was that was witnessed that night.

418
00:30:05,100 --> 00:30:09,460
All of them failing to enlighten those that were present for the initial event as to what

419
00:30:09,460 --> 00:30:12,620
it was they'd actually seen.

420
00:30:12,620 --> 00:30:18,100
In 1980, Norman Muscarello gave an in-depth interview wherein he was asked what he believed

421
00:30:18,100 --> 00:30:20,820
if he actually saw an Exeter that night.

422
00:30:20,820 --> 00:30:25,260
His response was that we would have to be naive and ignorant to believe ourselves alone

423
00:30:25,260 --> 00:30:32,020
in the universe, but ended by stating that he didn't know what it was.

424
00:30:32,020 --> 00:30:37,580
Muscarello died in 2003 and up to the time of his death insisted that what he'd seen

425
00:30:37,580 --> 00:30:43,620
was something extraordinary.

426
00:30:43,620 --> 00:30:48,500
Coming up on the next episode of On the Trail of UFOs.

427
00:30:48,500 --> 00:30:53,740
This is Nevada National Security Site area here, so they don't have to play by the same

428
00:30:53,740 --> 00:30:55,340
rules as the military.

429
00:30:55,340 --> 00:31:00,300
And this is one of those where one person came out and said that he worked on back-engineering

430
00:31:00,300 --> 00:31:02,300
alien technology at Area 51.

431
00:31:02,300 --> 00:31:07,300
Well, of course, the rumor was that Bob Lazar was working out there reverse-engineering

432
00:31:07,300 --> 00:31:12,340
express-trail spacecraft, and maybe they possess alien bodies.

433
00:31:12,460 --> 00:31:15,140
I knew Bob Lazar before he worked at Area S4.

434
00:31:15,140 --> 00:31:20,060
So several months we met at John Lair's house and he came and he says, you guys are totally

435
00:31:20,060 --> 00:31:21,220
freaking right.

436
00:31:21,220 --> 00:31:23,900
I'm working on my things.